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IRS managers are in favor of a significant budget increase by the Biden administration

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Starting with the IRS manager, the Professional Managers Association is steadily backing up the significant budget increases that government agencies will get under the Biden administration’s 2022 plan. Federal drive with Temin I talked to Chad Hooper, the secretary general of the association, to see what else they wanted.

Tom Temin: Chad, I’m glad I came back.

Chad Hooper: Thank you Tom.

Tom Temin: And it’s no exaggeration to say that the PMA is beyond the IRS alone at this point in history-is it correct?

Chad Hooper: Oh, of course, we are very worried about a government that is just right for all Americans. Of course, we want an effective tax enforcement mechanism to fund that government. But I’m a taxpayer myself, and I think the rest of the government’s property should work properly.

Tom Temin: And if you look at what the Biden administration has proposed to the IRS, it’s a pretty dramatic increase or a dramatic increase, depending on your point of view. Do you think you really need it all? So what is the real lack of your view of where the IRS is and where it should be?

Chad Hooper: We sincerely support the proposal of an infrastructure bill that will provide government agencies with $ 40 billion over a decade to improve enforcement outcomes and support the modernization and stabilization of current systems. .. We have been working on this for a long time. And the IRS urgently needs the same level of investment. Unfortunately, in response to your question as to whether this is the amount we need, in the past, perhaps 1998, or 2002, I think Congress acted faster and saved a fair amount of money. .. But every year we pass, without investing in such a large service, it becomes more and more expensive. Currently, the service spends about a quarter of its operational budget solely to stabilize the infrastructure associated with information technology. It’s an incredible waste.

Tom Temin: But on the other hand, I have been monitoring technology system modernization projects for 30 years. They spent billions of dollars resetting and then came back and reset again. There have always been these new starts, perhaps half a dozen of them in the last 30 years. Still, the master tax file is not updated. I know there is an up-to-date project they are working on. So is money the answer?

Chad Hooper: It’s been a long time since I had a conversation, so I look forward to working with you. In 1998, Congress passed a restructuring bill requiring the IRS, demanding that it enter the digital era and own an online account and everything familiar to the 21st century. And Congress did not fund the mission. So what I want to think about is that if there is a leak in the roof of the house, you can spot the roof of the house for a few dollars this year. And after a few storms, you’ll need to buy more speckles. And maybe that’s all you can afford in a budget year. And that’s the situation in the IRS, which has always been a multi-billion dollar project, but Congress will offer hundreds of millions of dollars. This is not a small amount. And I would like to emphasize that it is not a small amount. However, because this is a multi-year project and is subject to annual expenditures, the IRS prefers to fit these start and stop. And the budget is tight and they can continue to work. And even in the last 10 years we have tried 12 versions of the iPhone, but in the last 6 years we only have one version. Of the IRS core operating database. Therefore, Congress gets for their money without making a substantial one-time investment, or a multi-year budget investment that gives the IRS the flexibility to carry out this very large scale project. All you have to do is close the holes and create your own solution. To fill the IT gap. And that’s really about it. It wasn’t enough money to do what I needed.

Tom Temin: We are talking to Chad Hooper, who is the Executive Director of the Association of Professional Managers. And the idea of ​​a tax gap comes up regularly, the IRS proposes and the people who support it, as you said, need more examiners, more people to fill the tax gap. Say there is. To tell the truth, I remember what Thomas Jefferson said in one of his complaints against King George. He built a number of new offices and sent a flock of officers to harass our people and devour their substance. The IRS doesn’t necessarily want to do that, but what do you think about the tax gap? And what will be needed to fill the tax gap, what if there is something as big as some people actually think?

Chad Hooper: Yeah, absolutely. And thanks to Jefferson’s quote. I sincerely agree with that idea. From the perspective of government agencies, and from our point of view on behalf of their leadership, the IRS is incapable of harassing anyone. The IRS does not even have the ability to collect fair taxes from the wealthy at present. And the reason is that since the mid-1980s, the world has actually become much more complicated from an economic point of view. Given the former president, I think tax returns were well known in the news, and I knew there were dozens of overlapping companies, thousands and thousands of pages. About it About his own return. The IRS doesn’t even have the staff or ability to thoroughly audit such people. And there are quite a few. They do not necessarily have to be American taxpayers. There are many taxpayers around the world who are engaged in the American tax system. And these overlapping tax complications and texts, this kind of internationalism that went into the realm and is now backed by a great deal of machine learning and artificial intelligence, and a truly talented, highly intelligent international tax lawyer. It’s very easy for wealthy individuals and valuable businesses to avoid as many taxes as possible, as was created. And people are taking advantage of the code and all its warts and everything when it is possible to avoid taxes that are not necessarily illegal. Still, if fraud is possible and the IRS does not have sufficient tools at its disposal to mine accessible data, there is no fair way to enforce it. So low-income, or we are middle-income individuals, families, people like you and me, and our tax life is not complicated compared to millions and millionaires. Those people need more time, it’s easy for us to program the computer to check, did Chad report all the money in his W2, did Tom include his 1099? ?? But in the end, how do you look at the entire territory of 10,000 different partnerships and entities to understand one person’s income?

Tom Temin: And that’s a really nice Ferrari, you’re there, Chad. What are your hopes from a PMA perspective on the rest of Congress, especially with respect to the federal workforce in budget deliberations and what they see in 2022?

Chad Hooper: definitely. From a federal workforce perspective, I would like to see, Congress sometimes has a habit of the president making wage recommendations to civil servants, and if Congress does nothing, it will increase the wages of civil servants. Personally, I have problems as a taxpayer, looking back on the founder, the constitutional separation of powers, and the authority to assign them is the House of Representatives, regardless of who is in office. Give it to the administration. Irresponsible. Also, I don’t think it pays homage. Our civil servants, my members, and the people of the federal government as a whole have been relatively successful last year, giving much to carry the country over pandemics and economic turmoil. In particular, we look at countries in similar positions, apply a salary increase, express a kind of recognition or appreciation by signing a name on it, and parliament gathers to bring together the value of the federal workforce and what they say. Indicates that you are supporting. I want to see it, it’s something I challenge Congress to do better. At the same time, I am very grateful to President Biden for recommending federal workers to raise their salary by around 2.7%. Personally, I think it should be better than that. Many of my members have similar jobs that are far lower than they earn in the private sector. And I think the federal workforce deserves that support. Frankly, I’m also really happy to see the executive order on hiring and retaining the president and the growing diverse federal workforce that looks like the United States serving it. And I think Congress can do well to support these missions through funding, additional flexibility and employment authorities. I think Congress is on the right side of history and has the opportunity to improve many of the federal workers. It’s no longer an attractive workplace. We once thought of federal workers with very generous profits and very reliable wages. Tom, I’ve been a federal administrator for the last decade or so, but that wasn’t my experience. Tom, I moved from shutdown to shutdown and from layoff to layoff. My health insurance was much more than any other company. There are benefits of a generous vacation, but that’s really about it. And if you’re currently hiring a kid from college for $ 16 an hour to answer the phone, you can get a job at CVS for more money.

Tom Temin: Also, since it is a big problem, I wanted to hear the opinions and opinions of the members when I returned to work. Most institutions seem to postpone until August or September. What do your members tell you what they want to do and what they want to do?

Chad Hooper: It’s really a mix. I think the government’s hiring of telecommuting has really accelerated this time. And that was the flow we were always flowing, it was a kind of lightning speed. I entered this from the attitude of home like working from home. Especially in the case of the IRS, I think there are quite a lot of roles that can be separated from the office and save money for American taxpayers. You are not paying commuting subsidies, parking subsidies, or rent for large offices with nobody. I think there are many things that can be gained from it. At the same time, my members are leaders and want an effective and fair tax system. They want to serve taxpayers and give their employees the opportunity to feel supported, learn and connect. So many of my members want to get back to work. The IRS tends to be a little older than civil servants. As a result, their age population tends to be more vaccinated and they tend not to have young children at home. Not everyone says they won’t. But most of the time, my members want to go back to the office and meet again and again. Tom, I don’t necessarily believe that there is a future where everyone will come back five days a week. It used to be. But I think people have the flexibility to balance their lives and types. I think the pandemic of all of us is trying to refocus everyone’s priorities and balance work and family.

Tom Temin: Well, in a perfect world, everyone is back, there is no traffic, but I don’t think even Congress can do that. Chad Hooper is the secretary general of the Federal Managers Association. Thank you for your participation.

Chad Hooper: Thank you, Tom.

IRS managers are in favor of a significant budget increase by the Biden administration

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